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Billbad - For what it’s worth, I suppose I really could have made my point to you in less of an obnoxious tone, now that I re-read what I wrote in response to your earlier comment. This revamped Macbook really peeves me, but it should not lead me to be rude about it. I am glad I made my point, but I am sorry if I offended you in any way in doing so.

on January 27, 2009 at 06:19 PM - LINK

I HATE YOU! I HATE YOU! DIE! DIE! DIE! :)

on January 27, 2009 at 08:02 PM - LINK

LOL. Point taken.

on January 27, 2009 at 10:21 PM - LINK

Having been one of the oblivious fools who bought a new Macbook, assuming that since it was a Mac that it had to have Firewire, I am now angry both at Apple and myself. I am no longer able to use my mini-DV camcorder, which cost $1000 two years ago. Will there ever be a way to retrofit the current Macbook with firewire, either by removing the ethernet, or altering one of the USB ports? or something? Anything? Or jamming a firewire card somewhere in there? It is truly aweful that my ancient 2001 HP laptop now has more video capability than my new Macbook.

on February 12, 2009 at 07:52 AM - LINK

Unfortunately, there is no way to adapt a USB port to work with FW, as they are totally different. If Apple had at least included a PC Card slot in the MacBook, then you could have purchased a FW PC Card and used that.

on February 12, 2009 at 08:06 AM - LINK

Thanks, Chris. I should have gone for the Pro, but it was 15 inches and a lot more. Two strikes against it then for my needs, but the firewire thing is a total strikeout. So now I am tinkering with hooking my camcorder to my DVD recorder first, then trying to get my computers to recognize the DVD-VR result. Still trying to find a way out of the woods….

on February 12, 2009 at 08:37 AM - LINK

The guy at best-buy told me that they sold a firewire to USB cable, but when he tried showing me the cable they were all sold out. I’m not going to get the mac book; I’m waiting for the new Imacs or maybe the mac minis to come out. The Imacs are much more reasonably priced than the mac book are.

on February 12, 2009 at 09:56 AM - LINK

Unless there has been some dramatic breakthrough in the technologies, I doubt that Best Buy has (or will have) what you need. Read this, from http://www.wisegeek.com:

“Firewire (IEEE 1394) and USB (Universal Serial Bus) are two separate high-speed bus technologies that allow multiple devices to be connected to a computer. The two technologies are not integrated, and it is not possible to connect a USB device to a Firewire port either directly or through the use of a Firewire to USB adapter.”

But, there might be something out there that I don’t know about. If you get one, and it works, post your experience here. That would be really useful information and might make it more practical for people to buy a MacBook after all.

on February 12, 2009 at 03:24 PM - LINK

For the life of me, I can’t find anything that allows for Firewire devices to be connected to a USB port on the Best Buy or Radio Shack website. Scoot, either it’s not something that’s available in the USA or the guy you talked with at Best Buy isn’t much of a computer guy. I guess I’ll check out eBay.

on February 12, 2009 at 03:40 PM - LINK

For the people who are lost with out their firewire 400 ports

I also work in the sound industry and use drives with 400 and 800 ports, if you still are adamant you want to use your old drive with firewire 400 ports you can spend all of $11 for a little adaptor
http://www.amazon.com/Firewire-800-9-6-Adapter-Rohs/dp/B000LGGAD4/ref=tag_tdp_ptcn_edpp_url

or you can buy a new drive with 800 ports (and still dont require external power)
http://www.lacie.com/products/product.htm?pid=10949

have a nice day, please come again!!!

on March 20, 2009 at 04:57 PM - LINK

To Jonathan - Your link is for a good adapter for someone with only FW 800 ports on their laptop and FW 400 peripherals that they still want to use. But unfortunately, it is not a product that will address the current shortcomings of the new Macbook. The Macbook has no Firewire, only USB. As I posted earlier, there are no adapters that can enable someone to hook up a Firewire peripheral to a USB port.

To Anyone Else Who Cares - As long as FW remains absent from the Macbook line, anyone with FW 800 or 400 devices should steer clear of it. Either buy a used or refurbished older Macbook or pony up some serious cash for a Macbook Pro and the adapter that Jonathan mentioned, above.

on March 21, 2009 at 08:22 PM - LINK

I Fcukin hate Apple!
I’m a PC user, and this is the first time I buy an Apple product. I was shocked when I discovered that my Macbook doesn’t have FW! I went back to the store to complain and I asked them to repair it, but they didn’t accept because the laptop has been already used.. wtf man!! it didn’t even come into my mind to check if there’s a FW input..

I was doing the right thing by being a PC/Windows users

on May 10, 2009 at 11:06 PM - LINK

Sorry for your troubles, Maz. Too bad you didn’t come across this thread before you bought your Macbook. My only advice to you would be to sell it. It’s new and still has Apple’s transferable AppleCare warranty, so you should get a good amount of your money back. Personally, I think it’s adding insult to injury that Apple won’t accept it back as a return. It’s not what you expected when you bought it. But I guess a used computer is a used computer. I guess I can see why they would not take it back.

I guess not enough people have complained to Apple about this rotten policy to abandon FW. Apple is still churning out these FW-deprived Macbooks. And stupid people apparently don’t mind paying premium prices for inferior products, because they are still blowing their cash on them. You’d think in this economy most people would be smart enough to buy the most feature-laden laptops on the market, and not the Macbook.

In my opinion, we’d all be better off if we just said “no” when companies cheapen their products. Live with an older computer/car/cell phone, etc. for awhile longer. Hurt companies like Apple in their bottom line, where it counts, and thereby force them to keep providing customers with what they want and need. But we’re a country that likes disposable technology. If it ain’t the newest and flashiest, we don’t want it. Too bad. That’s why we, as consumers, are so taken advantage of on an almost daily basis.

on May 11, 2009 at 07:15 AM - LINK

Actually, I must retract my comment “stupid people apparently don’t mind paying premium prices for inferior products” because I actually don’t think of the people who prefer Apple computers as stupid. Bad choice of words. But I do think the people who buy these are not making the right choice.

on May 11, 2009 at 07:25 AM - LINK

Kirk - Maybe Maz is making his story up, since I agree it would seem unlikely that anyone would make the PC-to-Mac switch without researching the Mac thoroughly first, but some people buy on impulse and some are easily swayed by effective advertising. Only Maz knows if his post is legit. But you are wrong about PCs not “embracing” Firewire. Although FW was developed by Apple, it quickly became an industry standard for high-speed data transfers. All computers included it, across all lines. Mac calls it Firewire. PC manufacturers call it IEEE 1394.

I don’t know of any current PC, desktop or laptop, that does not come with IEEE1394 standard or as an add-on. I would call that “embraced”.

on May 11, 2009 at 07:51 AM - LINK

For anyone who cares:

Despite Wikipedia’s often sketchy reputation for inaccurate information, they have a very good entry on Firewire here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEEE_1394_interface

As you’ll see, it’s still a very viable and widely-used technology that, for most of the world and much of the video industry, is far from dead.

Also, if you scroll down to the bottom of the entry, you’ll see a very clear explanation as to why FW is actually faster than USB 2.0 in actual application.

on May 11, 2009 at 07:57 AM - LINK

Hey Kirk -

While it’s true that most new printers, external hard drives, and scanners are USB 2.0, many older peripherals for both Macs and PCs were built for Firewire. Almost all MiniDV cameras use FW to transfer video, and many older CD and DVD burners, laser printers, and external hard drives are FW compatible. It’s not hyperbole, it’s cold, hard financial fact that most consumers really can’t afford to replace all of the older Firewire-compatible equipment they have when they need to buy a new laptop. Especially when you consider that the entry-level Macbook starts at $1,299.

Even the cheapest, entry-level Dell Inspiron 15, at only $449, includes an ExpressCard slot, which would enable one to add FW-capability with a third-party FW ExpressCard (from Belkin, for example.) But the Macbook lacks an ExpressCard slot, so FW is not even an option at all at any price.

What Apple did is they kind of crippled their “lower-priced” laptops by removing FW and ExpressCard slots, forcing people with a real need for those features to have to pony up for a Macbook Pro, which starts at $1,999.

Of course, a $449 Dell is lacking in many features, and to equip one to match a comparable Macbook would equalize the prices somewhat, or at least narrow the cost differential. But the fact remains that no current Macbook at any price would ever be able to handle Firewire. So the actual cost of a new Macbook, plus a new camcorder, plus a new external hard drive, plus a new external DVD burner (if you needed one), plus a new laser printer for some could likely exceed $2,000; maybe by a lot.

I stand by my opinion: If you have lots of FW-compatible equipment, and it’s all in good working order, and you’re really a Mac person, DON’T buy a Macbook. Buy a Macbook Pro. It would cost as much as a Macbook plus upgrading all your “stuff” and you’ll have a better, faster, more versatile machine. But if you are not married to Apple computers, consider switching to a PC. You’ll save money and still be able to use the equipment you own.

on May 11, 2009 at 12:19 PM - LINK

One last comment for Kirk:

You said “and even the lowest priced MacBook still contains FireWire” in your last post. That’s not true. No new Macbook supports Firewire. Only the last generation (the all-white and all-black ones) have FW ports, and you can only buy them new as clearance items. You can still get refurbished ones from Apple, from time-to-time. As I said above, you’d need to spend $700 more for a lower end Macbook PRO for FW, and even then you won’t get FW 400. They only have FW 800, so you’d need to spend more on an adapter if you needed to hook up a FW 400 device, like a MiniDV camcorder.

on May 11, 2009 at 12:24 PM - LINK

First of all, Apple has 2 Macbook models they have the white polycarbonate that comes with a 2.0Ghz processor ddr2 ram the new Nvidea 9400m Graphics card. The next model they have is the Alluminum Macbook which you can choose from the 2.0Ghz or the 2.4Ghz which come with the same Nvidea 9400m graphic card and with DDR3 ram. The white Macbook is the old body but with new guts, but runs on DDR2 ram which hardly makes a difference, i have witnessed. i have the new aluminum 2.4 and my friend has the new Polycarbonate with the NVidea Graphics and there is really isn’t much of a difference in performance besides the esthetics.

Second, i see the new aluminum mac books everywhere on my campus. The majority of the people don’t even use firewire (they dont even know what it is). Anyone who really needs firewire will probably get the macbook pro, the white Macbook, or an Imac. who really needs firewire on the go, if you truly are a firewire user i think that you would want a more powerful computer.  There are speculation that apple removed the fire wire to make the laptop more reliable, apparently firewire ports are know to burn out and cause problems to the machine.

Third, for Maz from Dubai, i bought my mac book at future shop and i was considering to exchange it for the Macbook pro 2.4 or for an older Macbook pro (which are still really good machines, macs are very capable of lasting for a minimum of 6 years). Future shop had no problem with exchanging my aluminum Macbook 2.4 (that i had for 30 days) for any other computer in the store. I decided to keep my Macbook because i thought about it, and I really don’t need the firewire and its a great machine, if I ever really need to use firewire i have a firewire port on my mac mini. All this to say, try to exchange your laptop if your really unhappy. Just don’t put down i think they know what they are doing.

on May 11, 2009 at 01:01 PM - LINK

I stand corrected on the white Macbook issue. At the time of this original posting, when the aluminum Macbooks were brand new, the white Macbook was being discontinued and could only be available until supplies ran out. Apparently, Apple decided to keep that line going awhile longer. Good for them. But that was not the case a few months ago. My guess is the negative uproar over the removal of Firewire caused Apple to rethink its decision to eliminate it altogether from Macbooks. I am glad to see that I still do have a Macbook option after all. Thanks for bringing that to my attention, Kirk.

As for the idea that it’s OK to drop Firewire because “The majority of the people don’t even use firewire (they dont even know what it is)” and “if you truly are a firewire user i think that you would want a more powerful computer” are the really naive comments that reinforce to companies that it OK to cut back on features but not price. A great many people do know what FW is, use it regularly, and have no need for a more powerful computer. I use an old Powerbook G4. I rely on Firewire for printing to my laser printer, video editing, audio work, and regular backups to my external hard drive for work and home. I am not an A/V professional. I have no need for more processing speed, but I do have a real need for FW. I do not have the budget for a Macbook Pro, nor can I afford to replace all my “stuff” with USB 2.0 versions.

I also think that the idea that Apple didn’t drop FW in an effort to get people to spend more for a Pro model is also quite naive. Apple has followed that practice for many years. They offer limited options in all their product lines, with almost no add-ons or upgrade capability, forcing people to spend a great deal more for what should be available at all levels.

I love Macs. I way prefer the Mac OS to Windows. I like the styling of Apple products. I am a big fan. But I don’t like to see “progress” at the expense of people who need older technology to make use of the substantial investment they have made in perfectly good, functional, albeit older equipment. I read once that Apple saved about $5.00 per unit by dropping Firewire. Multiplied across thousands of units and you see a significant cost savings, there.

Apple knows what it’s doing, alright. They are making money hand over fist. Good for them. It doesn’t mean they made the right decision by the consumer.

BTW - I appreciate this open, frank discourse and I ultimately respect any and all opinions on this matter. Please don’t take offense to any comments I make, as they are not personal. I am simply, persistently bothered by Apple’s policies regarding the direction it is taking its product line.

on May 11, 2009 at 02:08 PM - LINK

Most likely my last word on this topic, and these are not even my own words! This is from the MacInTouch.com October 21, 2008 review of the aluminum MacBook, by Robert Mohns:

“FireWire — a technology Apple invented and popularized — disappeared from the aluminum MacBook. It’s used for hard drives, video capture, audio hardware and high-end scanners — essential devices for Apple’s huge base of “creative professional” users.

If you depend on hardware that requires FireWire, you must either upgrade to the $1999 MacBook Pro, or downgrade to the older, white Macbook (which is available now for $999).

Apple CEO Steve Jobs defended the decision, stating that most consumer camcorders now use USB instead of FireWire. That doesn’t do much good for someone who already owns a FireWire-only camcorder; for most of us, that’s a pretty big investment! And USB 2, despite its huge speed improvement over USB 1, still isn’t suitable for professional audio work — it just isn’t designed for time-sensitive data.

In hopes of getting a view into more typical consumer behavior, we talked to a salesperson at an Apple retail store. He said he was selling a lot of the new MacBooks even without FireWire. When asked how we could get video from our FireWire camcorder onto the new MacBook, the salesperson candidly answered, “You can’t, and I know that’s not a good answer.”

We asked if the week’s buyers knew or cared about the loss of FireWire. “A few people have been pretty upset,” we were told, but many don’t have any FireWire devices. A few buyers, he volunteered, did require FireWire, and in every instance, they went up to the MacBook Pro, not down to the white MacBook. But, he noted, “We’re not all billionaires, a video camera is a big investment!”

The long-requested, but still-missing eSATA port would take the sting out of losing FireWire, and a fast I/O bus always can be exploited. USB is seriously deficient when it comes to multi-device data streaming; it may be good enough for Apple, but it’s not adequate for a small, but influential, portion of Apple’s traditional customer base.

We think it’s a big mistake to take such a versatile, useful feature out of Apple’s most popular laptop arbitrarily. But the marginal cost of upgrading to a MacBook Pro is less than the cost of a new video camera or audio hardware; maybe that’s what Apple is counting on. If so, it’s an artificial and cynical product segmentation tactic.”

on May 11, 2009 at 04:22 PM - LINK